What the Dupatta should really cover ….

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113 responses to “What the Dupatta should really cover ….”

1. 

   James Killian Spratt

   September 15, 2009

   @Shakir: Ha-ha. Why am I having trouble feeling much sympathy for the young man? Lemme guess, now the restauranteurs in Karachi are having no-o-o problem hiring waiters.

   A couple of years ago there was a big stink here about a female high-school teacher, a real beauty in her early twenties, who seduced one of her male students, age fifteen or so, and I think had a child with him. She was acquitted of “statutory rape” charges, but I don’t think she should have been–the young man is now a father, and she has set his life on a course that can’t be reversed, that he surely wouldn’t have chosen if he had been more mature. If the teacher had been male, and the student female, there’s no question that the teacher would be behind bars. I doubt that the female teacher will have her teaching contract renewed. Her husband divorced her, natch.

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2. 

   Hend

   September 14, 2009

   Scholars

   Please enlighten me in understanding this.

   I have heard that the tradition of wearing a Burqa or Hijab is actually an Arab tribal custom rather than something prescribed in Islam, is this true? Does Islam prescribe covering of full face, except eyes?

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3. 

   Shakir Lakhani

   September 14, 2009

   @ James: I’ve read three cases of rape committed by women (if rape can be defined as forced sexual intercourse). The first was in Europe (Belgium, I think) many years ago. The second was in Malaysia a couple of years back. And the third was a few months back in my very own city (Karachi) when three women persuaded a young handsome waiter to go with them on some pretext or the other, then forced him to have sex with them at gunpoint one after the other. He went to the cops who got him medically examined, and the doctor confirmed that his “attachment” was bruised and bloody.

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4. 

   James Killian Spratt

   September 14, 2009

   @Mohamed: Using force does not convince the other side of the rightness of your convictions; it only convinces them that they need to shoot back. If they didn’t care for your convictions before you started shooting at them, they surely will be turned even harder against you after you do shoot at them. If you persist, they will be forced to hunt you down as a dangerous nuisance, with an eye toward extermination. I was trying to keep Brother Adnan from getting killed.

   Your posture on who is guilty in a rape is unclear; it is the male who is guilty, not the female. Women can’t rape men, for obvious reasons; a rape event cannot occur without male initiative, and that makes the male the criminal, not the female. She should get sympathy, he should get punishment. To protect the family system, it is male behavior that needs to be controlled. To try to “blame the victim,” the female, is not sane.

   It is known, however, for a female to seduce a male, but that makes the sex act consensual, and not a rape. If such an act is “taboo,” as it is everywhere if either the male or the female is married to another who is not present and would not consent, then both are guilty if they both knew of the marriage. Some women will claim they were raped after the fact, to try to conceal their own complicity, or willingly indulge in “illicit” sex because they don’t care about “family”.

   “Stoop?” I’m 59, and have not been asleep the whole time, so I’ve accumulated quite a few files on my hard-drive, metaphorically speaking, so I might call it “standing up.” How old are you?

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5. 

   Mohamed

   September 13, 2009

   @James, I respect and appreciate you trust your experiences and hope you too would respect Adnan’s experiences as much, than rather trying to talk him out of his beliefs.

   Though local cultures ignorant of the higher values of Islam may consider otherwise, Rape victims are not necessarily a blanket taboo in Islam. Maintaining standards of chastity to protect the society and prevent break-down of family system is considered important in Islam, so it is expected one does not put himself or herself in harms way.

   Criminals breaking law are not written-off but punished to rectify and to illustrate consequences to others, similarly in Islam whether it is a man or woman loosing virginity outside of marriage in a public affair, is dealt with in a sophisticated mechanism of prosecution leading to acquittal or punishment. So why is it hard for the west to tolerate and respect an alternate system that actually works!

   In statistics contextual variations manifest in exceptions not in established patterns. For e.g. a handful of countries not following the pattern would require interpretation to explain the context of their deviation. The statistics illustrated are a pattern of stark fact without requiring interpretations to hide behind.

   You completely missed the point on the ‘legal systems’ example. It was to help you see that Islam is a macro system and its not about “Forcing one’s will on others is immoral by my lights” or any individual’s random whim.

   Your tease in guessing my age no doubt coming from the little head misses the mark exceedingly, I assure you the little head purporting itself as big head is just whipping-up a theory to explain its relevance as you get further beyond 50. As for me I would not stoop to depend on age to qualify myself.

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6. 

   Shakir Lakhani

   September 13, 2009

   James: there are people (extremists, for instance) who let their little heads determine their actions throughout their lives. You can’t expect such people to change. They remain bigoted all their lives. And they think they’re always right.

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7. 

   James Killian Spratt

   September 12, 2009

   Men have two heads, a little one and a big one. For the first thirty or so years of adult life, until we are perhaps fifty years old, the little head gives its instructions to the big one, and the big one applies itself to keeping the little head happy. After this longish period of time, the big head finally realizes that the little head has been making it work awfully hard, then rebels, tells the little one to sit down and shut up, and occupies itself with higher matters.

   Women are persons who happen to be female. They have two heads, too, but their little head generally has much less influence over their big ones because their little head can get them into much more trouble much more quickly if their big head doesn’t get it right when dealing with men, whose big heads are only working part-time until they’re fifty years old. Or maybe because it’s smaller, whatever.

   Between a couple, for their joint benefit and survival, there has to be at least one big head working at all times, or almost all, or things get stupid and fall apart in a hurry.

   So young men, give your big head some time off from your little one while you’re young enough to get something out of it.

   Mohamed: I trust nothing outside my own experience. You can find statistics that will “prove” any viewpoint you’re looking to prove, but I think here we need to consider contextual variation in interpretation. I don’t know where you live, but in the West a rape victim garners sympathy from all directions, and is not considered “ruined” but rather “traumatized,” which is survivable and recoverable in time; she’s not a write-off. Neither is a woman a write-off if she loses her virginity, willingly or unwillingly, before marriage.

   I also don’t give legal systems a blanket pass, either. Although most of them are justifiable in the most part because they apply universal common sense, like not running redlights, etc., they are all to some extent written by human males who are thinking with their big heads, but subverted by their little heads.

   I bet you’re under thirty. 🙂

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8. 

   Mohamed

   September 12, 2009

   @James, On morality statistics speak louder than words, countries that adopt what you don’t consider immoral dress sense, have higher rates of “per-capita rape” than the countries that have more modest dressing whether for religious or traditional reasons here is the link to help you see the light – http://tinyurl.com/zctax

   Regarding enforcing Islamic law being immoral, you never consider a legal system immoral because it forces itself on the place & people it applies to. Islam is a similar legal system true Muslims want to abide by so you must just learn to respect that if you can.

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9. 

   Kashif H

   September 12, 2009

   what a reply jks LOL! Anyhow what I meant was the sensitivities and the anaylitical observations you made regarding gender roles and movements in society i.e. in your earlier replies. The speech kinda drifted from observing seggregation between sexes to poetic, plutonic etc etc…This piece of literature has invited more comments then I had expected…!

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10. 

    Mohamed

    September 12, 2009

    Mr. Moderator,

    Could you please fix the first link in my previous post.

    Thanks// Mohamed

    Reply