Happy Anniversary to our beloved Democracy

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34 responses to “Happy Anniversary to our beloved Democracy”

1. 

   Hend

   February 24, 2010

   “I was a witness in a civil suit the other day”

   i know it is a big business or common practice to sell as witness in pakistan… how much money do you make this way? if you do well then may be pillars of your democracy like 10% will seek your services?

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2. 

   Hend

   February 24, 2010

   “Hend: supposing a people want a theocracy, what then?”
   then it ceases to be a democracy as the control is handed to religion.

   “Do you know that there are elections in Iran?”
   yes the world is aware of the whole process and i can go in very much depth if you need…bad example.

   “Do you know that there are women judges in Pakistan”
   are you trying to prove that judiciary is for sale? 🙂

   it is a shame that all of you together cannot come up with one decent example or proof in your defence…but then could that be because your argument is wrong…hahaha

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3. 

   Shakir Lakhani

   February 23, 2010

   @ Hend: supposing a people want a theocracy, what then? Do you know that there are elections in Iran? Do you know that there are women judges in Pakistan (I was a witness in a civil suit the other day, where the judge was a 40-year old attractive woman who didn’t have her head covered). By the way, why does the Indian president cover her hair (although she did say something against the hijab once)?

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4. 

   Shakir Lakhani

   February 23, 2010

   James: in Islam, there is a provision for revision by consensus, as I said earlier. I’ve heard that slavery was banned in this manner by Muslim scholars. No doubt, in years to come, the veil will be made optional in Iran and Saudi Arabia, and “jihad” will revert to its original meaning of self-defense.

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5. 

   Hend

   February 23, 2010

   spratt

   my argument is based on the true definition of democracy as we all understand it.

   i am giving my points in a more organized manner this time as people are confusing my stance with being anti islamic.

   i strongly believe that a pure theocracy or a religious state cannot be a true democracy. and if it is a purely democratic state then it cannot claim to be a religious state. this applies whether you take saudi arabia or vatican or any other country which claims to have a state religions. simple reason is in a democracy, people elect their representatives, people make their rules and people are free to make or change rules based on ‘popular’ demand.

   i am no where arguing that a democracy is a superior form of governance in every respect but i do argue that it is a more acceptable form in many parts of the world because people decide what they want.

   now let us differentiate between a theocracy and a religion. turkey is a muslim majority country but is not a theocracy unlike pakistan or saudi arabia where the religious laws or shariat are implemented partially or fully.

   in a true democracy there is nothing in constitution which cannot be changed but in a theocracy there is a set of rules which are given by the religion and are not open for discussion.

   pakistan is actually half cooked egg because it is neither a true democracy (regardless of state religion) due to full control by military nor is it a proper islamic state because they have not fully implemented all provisions of shariat. essentially they are a islamic hindu state where people resist shariat due to their hindu cultural and mental legacy.

   now moving onto religion…i specifically refer to semitic or prophet/ book driven religions here…there is no question of any religion being democratic simply because not even people of those religion can change the laws prescribed in it. the book remains the same…unlike religions based on philosophy which may have some room for change.

   finally…in a true democracy…though people still follow religion…they are free to not follow it…in a theocratic state…not following the religion has implications…either legal or social.

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6. 

   James Killian Spratt

   February 23, 2010

   @Hend: “can you change some of the rules of islam…” I think you’re addressing the matter from the purist viewpoint, for the sake of the discussion. My feeling is that only Muslims can adapt their own rules–it’s their practice, not ours; we don’t know enough about it, or care, really. I read that Turkey is looking over parts of it that are problematical with EU values with an eye to joining. Well, good luck to ’em. If Islam wants to become democratic, there’s little mystery on how to do it without losing all of the *deen.* Your grandma’s cooking will still smell like curry, and mine’s will still smell like bacon and eggs; mosque will still be a place of cheery time-out from the hassles of the world, just like church or temple, if they make it so.

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7. 

   Hend

   February 23, 2010

   shakir

   i have specially mentioned earlier that no theocracy can be really democratic…least so one based on islam. you have as expected lapsed into a diatribe about hinduism and thus lost track of your own argument because country and religion are two different things.

   hamza

   why do you expect me to agree that islam is democratic when it is not. and yes india is truly democratic with equal rights to all minorities… no doubt. the implementation fails sometimes but the constitution is fully democratic and can evolve as people want. a true democracy.

   spratt

   no objection to being religious…but the argument here is whether islam is democratic…my response is counter question…can you change some of the rules of islam people want it? can an islamic country do it?

   i dont know where people get these weird ideas about the most rigid religion.

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8. 

   Abu Hamza

   February 23, 2010

   @Hend: Going through your comments, I came to conclusion that you are here just to bash Islam and Pakistan. You do not have any thing constructive to say.

   You think Islam is incompatible with democracy. What about the self-proclaimed largest democracy of the world? You think India is democratic, giving equal rights to minorities?

   Democracy is another facade like communism and secularism.

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9. 

   James Killian Spratt

   February 23, 2010

   @Tayab: “We are trying to hide behind democracy……” To much of the non-Muslim world it looks exactly the opposite, like you’re trying to hide behind the Quran to avoid educating yourselves with Democracy.

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10. 

    Shakir Lakhani

    February 23, 2010

    @ Hend: I suppose, according to your twisted mind, a religion which forces a fourth of its followers (Dalits) to do dirty work of all kinds is compatible with democracy. And a democratic country is one like India, where twemty percent of its population (Muslims) is periodically subjected to genocidal attacks by people like Narendra Modi, who not only remains free but is elected to rule the state in which he carried out the killings, simply because the majority (Hindus) approved of the mass murder of Muslims.

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